Survey: Yamaha Factory is Listening

I have been asked by YMC to provide them with some detailed information on the likes and dislikes of both Yamaha snowmobile owners and those who choose to ride other brands.

Of course the first place I thought of to post the link is on TY but if any of you have credibility on some of the other forums, it would be greatly appreciated if you could place a link for us where we might get some additional feedback.

The past surveys that I have posted here have proven invaluable in our quest to drive home some specific points with our engineers. This one will be no different. Thanks in advance.
cr

Heres the link:

SpringSMBsurvey

Did the survey. It was mostly about EPS. The only reason for EPS is because the sleds are too damn heavy. Also, I anticipate the wear on steering components will increase significantly. I would never attempt to turn my skis without the machine moving and with EPS you can do just that. Drop a hundred pounds, get the geometry right and presto, easy to steer without adding additional weight to the sled to overcome the additional weight of the sled. I would love to love my Yamaha but I am going to the doo side for next winter until I see what Yamaha does for 2013. I still wouldn't buy a guinea pig 2013 until they are 2014's because of the problems I've had with a first year sled. The engines and appearance of our machines is awesome, but they lack in just about every other department. I've always said they are superior groomed trail machines but that's where it ends. I'd love to buy a new Nytro XTX and spend another 5 to 7 thousand on it to make it an awesome machine but when you can buy what you want/need stock from the showroom floor, why go through the trouble of modifying a mediocre snowmobile? I hope I am not offending anyone by saying this (and I apoligize if I am)but I am speaking from personal experience and as a member of TY for 3 years who has vigorously read everything I can get my mouse on. Peace, brothers. Yamaha, I hope you are listening.

Yup, weight is certainly an issue (lose the weight and there is no need for EPS), as is the Yamaha poor quality plastic bushings, SKIS, hand warmers, and issues with slide wear. These are the same issues that keep cropping up year after year.

One item that wasn't touched on in the survey is the price of a sled in Canada. On average, the list price a Canadian pays is over $2500 more than buying a sled in the States. Talk about rape. That goes for parts too. Time to step up and be fair. No wonder why a lot of us Canadians are angry at Yamaha Canada, which hardly deserves another purchase.

I'd be curious to see some stats on how many Canadians head south of the border to buy a new sled. Yamaha Canada should start matching prices with the States...then sales will improve.

We already know 4 strokes can be alot lighter with the new green ones coming out but will have to see how they handle. Maybe Yamaha wants to play follow the leader!

I am a 90% on-trail rider so the weight of the sled didnt/doesnt bother me all that much. Yes, they probably would be better sleds if they were lighter but I loved my Apex and now I do love my Nytro XTX. What has bothered my over the years about Yamaha...is that they let the little things/issues (that add up to be big issues/money over time) put a bad taste in my mouth. The Apex= idler wheels, exhaust donuts, cracked rails, hyfax, bushings, skis, handwarmers, tunnel heat exchanger leaks etc. The Nytro= subframe, skis, exhaust donuts, bushings, handwarmers, hyfax, storage etc. Yamaha claims reliability and although the engines hold up to that statement...the rest of the sled doesnt. Yamaha makes a great engine but a 2009 Apex shouldnt have the same issues a 2006 had (and a 2010 Fx Nytro shouldnt have the same issues as the 2008 model).

i actually dont have many complaints about my sleds,dont know if its the way i ride and do maintenance on them but many issues noted from others dont affect me,they are bullet proof if you ask me,exhaust donuts are not a major issue for me,so is hyfax wear,they last a full season every season ,we actually ride on snow,not ice and grass,there are a few little annoying things like fuel pump relays,throw away idler wheels,some issues have been taken care of so its going in the right direction,some weight could be shed but not like the paper thin foil doo's that need reinforcements to stay together,my 2 cent

The way i see it right now we are at the 10 year mark of four-stroke yamaha sleds.These yamaha sleds over the years have racked up mileage in winters that would put the 2-stroke sleds of years past(and current 2-strokes)to shame.Years ago most people(including myself)would get rid of a sled before it hit the 5000 mile mark and trade it in on a new model(in my case a 98 indy500 for the 04 warrior).This still is a mindset today for the competition(you think folks who order the new 2012 cats are going to keep them past a winter or two?Not likely).With these high miles on our sleds your going to wear out bushings,sliders and brake pads,its the nature of the beast.Were at a point right now in snowmobiling where the motor in theory,could outlast the chassis.Its a higher rung in the ladder on the way to the ideal sled(Great powertrain).Now the next step yamaha needs is a reduce weight(and keep the great side to side balance they have) without turning yamaha sleds into the competition(the BIC lighter way of building sleds-when it stops working,get rid of it and buy a new one).Don,t ever recall seeing poos,doos,or putty tats with 40000 miles on them(but how many snowmobilers put 40000 miles on a sled in its life?)

Did the survey.

Probably the best survey from any manufacturer I have ever taken. I think YMCA looking for input on the product is AWESOME !!!!!

My major beef is the ice build up in the skid and around the new track adjusters.

A drop of 50-75 lbs would be nice but I have no interest in a light bouncy beach ball like sled . I do not want to give up my QDR though.

I put this comment in the last space available for comment at the end of the survey.

"Canadian pricing of sleds and parts is too high. Hurting our Canadian dealers and forcing many to buy in the US.

Riceburner,

I'm in the process of fabricating a cover for those track tension adjustment bolts.

Thank you for offering this Chris. And thanks for the nice things you said about Turk in you blog.

pat the rat said:

i actually dont have many complaints about my sleds,dont know if its the way i ride and do maintenance on them but many issues noted from others dont affect me,they are bullet proof if you ask me,exhaust donuts are not a major issue for me,so is hyfax wear,they last a full season every season ,we actually ride on snow,not ice and grass,there are a few little annoying things like fuel pump relays,throw away idler wheels,some issues have been taken care of so its going in the right direction,some weight could be shed but not like the paper thin foil doo's that need reinforcements to stay together,my 2 cent

Click to expand...

X2 !!!

Done

Done. Hope in future we can have working handlebar heaters in our reasonable priced Yamaha sleds...

Survey update

Well it hasn't been 24 hours since I posted the survey and I already have received 100 responses. I am reading all the comments as well and want to thank you guys for responding maturely with some well written, honest and understandable comments. 'Tough love' so to speak!

I am comfortable in sending YMC direct links to this thread today, knowing our guys will be able to absorb the information without feeling attacked... thanks again

cheers
cr

Mr Reid:

I did the survey and reflected my post here in the survey.

But please tell YMC in Japan a few things:

1. There are some who would really like the Apex MTX back.

Maybe a spring order 153" / 162" version choice for those who think the 162" is just a tad too long. Maybe change things to use more of the Nytro MTX components, maybe even the Yamaha aftermarket 162" lightweight suspension. They mated the XTX skid to the Apex chasis, so they could mate the MTX skid there easily enough also.

2. Skis are a perenial bugaboo for Yamaha. Maybe team with an aftermarket company to use their skis. Like USI, or Simmons, or C&A.

3. Shock valving continues to be bad. Yamaha teams with awesome companies like Ohlins, but then has them install a valve stack for a 135 pound person. Not good for real world users. Why make us ship our shocks out for improvements ourselves? Better valving.

4. Bushings in skids and a arms are just not tough enough. My Mono skid bushing were shot at 2,500 miles. I went with an after market company to replace them, not Yamaha bushings.

5. Exhaust donuts. The stock ones were terrible. Enough said on this.

Thx Mr Reid!!!!!!