What is your opinion when the mighty Apex motor goes away that it gets replaced with a three cylinder version around 160+hp naturally aspirated, and a boosted three cylinder option near 190hp? All centered still around the nytro motor for flat landers? So a 130hp viper, a 160+ NA motor, and a turbo version about 185-190? The turbo having tunnel coolers to help with the heat issue they might have now? You would lose that awesome sound, the freight train pull, and the build ability of a monster sled motor like the Apex, but get a lighter version. Hopefully if the small talk I hear is true we get a different platform for one of these. I Still think there is a market for that sit down, cruiser, lake racing body style like the Apex, Vector, or even a ski Doo 1200 body style. We shall see, but the motor options are more rumors for our summer. All I hope is if they do replace the long lived Apex it is with something great. Don't be like GM, and reuse names like Lemans, GTO, etc and come out with a dud to carry on a great tradition, and name. Bad enough the srx went into a kids sled.
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I would have loved to see the Apex engine in the Viper chassis, either that or boost on the Apex.
Yamaha does need to come out with a new look.... something with the Apex engine and 180 stock hpr.
Yamaha does need to come out with a new look.... something with the Apex engine and 180 stock hpr.
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Weight means nothing to me. 120 HP is good as long as it has rear exit exhaust, 4 cyl., 2 of the reason I wont buy a Viper.
Ya had a yamaha guy tell me they may stretch the legs on the existing motor some, then have a boosted option for the trail like they did for the mountains. The trail system need extra cooling though if they do that front dump. Too much heat for those 200 miles day without some extra cooling. Not sure about the nytro motor In a higher hp capacity an/A version though.
I ran into a Dozen guys this year in Michigan that went back to Apex's. They surfed around the other manufacturer's offerings the last few years and went back to EPS Apex's.
newfie09xtx
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If yamaha came out with a turbo sealevel version of the viper it would probably be my next sled, when I buy, providing it came with decent warranty. Without this I will be shopping.
06dukeGT
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Well every 10 years or so they redesign the corvette, and usually make it lighter, faster, and try and better the last generation. Yamaha needs to have a new design for the apex. What guys love about them is that they just aren't throwaway sleds after a year or two. Take care of it with proper PM and the apex will last long long time! I believe the next apex will not disappoint our wishes! Then again I might be dreaming! 
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Apex four hole is 8pds heavier then the three whole. It is smaller in size and well it is a four cylinder and does not sound like a tractor. Everywhere I go Apex outnumbers the three hole. I know myself I want the four, its the flagship motor and what started it all. Dropping it all would be sacreligious. So much so that I would consider a 1200 Doo if I need to replace my sled.
The only way I see getting 160hp out of the three hole is by either adding boost, displacement or rpm. Its a dream if you think that 160hp is possible any other way. Turbo would be nice but with that comes more underhood heat, (Ya you could rear mount a turbo but then comes lag) complexity and weight might as well stay with the Apex.
You could poke and stroke it but bigger crank throws, rods and pistons all add weight. A 1500cc three banger would get you to the 160 plus mark. On top of that it would probably sound even more like a tractor and weigh as much as the four.
You could spin it faster and add a counterbalancer but then it looses its 8 pound advantage over the Apex.
There is a reason they built the three hole, it was to fill the 120 130 hp class. It started out at 120 and after cam changes and displacement increases they ramped it up to 130. Cross plane (as some rant about) will not get you to 160, it was designed to smooth the power impulses not increase hp.
Why people rag on the four hole and praise the three has me puzzled. The extra weight is not in the motor as much as the chassis. The Viper is no lighter then the Nytro. The Apex weighs more because of the chassis. Rather then drop a three hole in that weighs now a much as the four to get 160hp just drop the four in. Makes more sense.
If Yami builds a new Chassis I hope it has the strength to match the Apex chassis. If Yami drops the four from thier lineup they will piss off a lot of Apex die hards, but on the bright side my Apex will be worth more as more people will run them forever. I know if Yami drops the four then this will probably be my last sled. At my age I could make it last till I'm to old to ride anymore! if they keep the four then a 2016 Apex will probably be my next sled.
The only way I see getting 160hp out of the three hole is by either adding boost, displacement or rpm. Its a dream if you think that 160hp is possible any other way. Turbo would be nice but with that comes more underhood heat, (Ya you could rear mount a turbo but then comes lag) complexity and weight might as well stay with the Apex.
You could poke and stroke it but bigger crank throws, rods and pistons all add weight. A 1500cc three banger would get you to the 160 plus mark. On top of that it would probably sound even more like a tractor and weigh as much as the four.
You could spin it faster and add a counterbalancer but then it looses its 8 pound advantage over the Apex.
There is a reason they built the three hole, it was to fill the 120 130 hp class. It started out at 120 and after cam changes and displacement increases they ramped it up to 130. Cross plane (as some rant about) will not get you to 160, it was designed to smooth the power impulses not increase hp.
Why people rag on the four hole and praise the three has me puzzled. The extra weight is not in the motor as much as the chassis. The Viper is no lighter then the Nytro. The Apex weighs more because of the chassis. Rather then drop a three hole in that weighs now a much as the four to get 160hp just drop the four in. Makes more sense.
If Yami builds a new Chassis I hope it has the strength to match the Apex chassis. If Yami drops the four from thier lineup they will piss off a lot of Apex die hards, but on the bright side my Apex will be worth more as more people will run them forever. I know if Yami drops the four then this will probably be my last sled. At my age I could make it last till I'm to old to ride anymore! if they keep the four then a 2016 Apex will probably be my next sled.
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NOS-PRO said:
My Apex XTX hits 110mph on a trail with me on it. It pulls like there is no tommorow and while I agree with more hp because I'm a hp junkie I sometime question whether or not its needed.
I don't like the Viper chassis per say, I don't hate it either but its not what I want for my riding! So I'm thinking a Apex powered replacement from Yami would be my best hope even with 160hp!
RAMSOMAIR
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apex
AMEN!Sasquatch said:
Sasquatch said:
I agree! A strung out nutrition motor barely lasts on race day rumor has it
ViperTurboPete
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I am sure this question has been asked before....but what about the current R1 crossplane engine at 182.1 hp????? How come it is not in the Apex? I remember when the RX1's were carbed and the talk was about the fuel injection in the new Yamaha bikes. Next thing you know...out came the Apex with FI.
It would be nice to see this engine...if it is even possible I don't know....be planted in a newly designed updated chassis. I am sure this could fulfill everyone's power hungry needs. I apologize if this has been discussed before...
2014 YZF R1 Crossplane Engine Specifications
Type 4-stroke, 4-row cylinder, 16-valve, DOHC
Displacement 998 cc
Bore x stroke 78.0 mm x 52.2 mm
Compression ratio 12.7: 1
Maximum power 133.9 kW (182.1 hp) @ 12,500 rpm / min (without forced air intake)
Maximum torque 115.5 Nm (11.8 kg-m) @ 10,000 rpm / min
Lubrication system Dry sump
Coupling type Wet, multiple disc
Starter system Electric
Transmission 6-speed system
Final drive Chain
Fuel supply EFI
Cooling system Liquid cooling
It would be nice to see this engine...if it is even possible I don't know....be planted in a newly designed updated chassis. I am sure this could fulfill everyone's power hungry needs. I apologize if this has been discussed before...
2014 YZF R1 Crossplane Engine Specifications
Type 4-stroke, 4-row cylinder, 16-valve, DOHC
Displacement 998 cc
Bore x stroke 78.0 mm x 52.2 mm
Compression ratio 12.7: 1
Maximum power 133.9 kW (182.1 hp) @ 12,500 rpm / min (without forced air intake)
Maximum torque 115.5 Nm (11.8 kg-m) @ 10,000 rpm / min
Lubrication system Dry sump
Coupling type Wet, multiple disc
Starter system Electric
Transmission 6-speed system
Final drive Chain
Fuel supply EFI
Cooling system Liquid cooling
Sasquatch
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RX1MPete said:
Thats easy! 12,500rpm! Current Apex is bang on at 10,800ish. Have to slow that clutch down 2,000 rpm. Much larger gear reducer needed to reduce rpm by 33% from 12,500 to 8,500. Guess that is possible with a recast of the bike engine.
With the exup you could help the softer bottom end you are going to have. Something that is inherant to the crossplane at low rpm full throttle. Maybe that is what the exup is for?
But in reality the crossplane design does not add hp so like the motor we have now if they come out with a 11,000 rpm crossplane it will make about 160hp. So the real question is will Yamaha spin thier four hole at 12,500rpm in the sled? What is the million dollar answer to that one? Only Yamaha knows!
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Sasquatch said:
I hear ya Charlie, but a lot of people are looking for that extra hpr. The Viper is a sled that is different from the Apex and a lot of people like/love their Apex....a lot of people like their vectors with the ride style. I loved my Attak, but the Viper fits me better....plus I have the Viper doing a true 105-106mph on GPS now so the 3 hole engine has better pull on bottom where the 4 has it on top.
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Sasquatch said:
Yamaha could do it, just a different gear reduction. WOuldn't that bad boy sound kick #*$&@ going down the trail!!!!!! 13,000 RPM redline and spinning the clutch at 9,000? YEAH BABY!!!!!
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