dirkdiggler
Suspended
Yamaha has become better at Marketing then it has at building industry leading snowmobiles. Yes Yamaha offers the best motor in the industry. But the chassis, Suspension, Handling and Power are far from the best.
I know we haven't gotten the final specs on the new Yamaha yet. Unless this version of the Apex is 50 pounds lighter and makes 165 plus HP it's not a game changer. I love Yamaha but this is yet another chapter in a long list of disappointments for me with Yamaha.
Here is my idea of a game changer
1. Dry weight 500 pounds
2. Weight weight 575
3. 165 HP
4. Power Steering With a C&A razor type ski with 10 inches of carbide.
5. New Chassis
6. New Rear suspension that works like a mono in studder pumps and
and Nytro RTX SE in the moguls
7. New front end that has Zero Ski lift and corners like it's on rails but still eats the bumps Nytro RTX SE in the moguls
8. High out magneto that allows hand warms to work at all times and keep yoru hands warm at any temp.
9. True closed loop fuel Injection.
If I was to build a sled by taking pieces from the four OEMs the only piece I'd use from Yamaha is Power Steering. In my book that's pretty sad considering the "game changer" Promotion!!!!!!!
I know we haven't gotten the final specs on the new Yamaha yet. Unless this version of the Apex is 50 pounds lighter and makes 165 plus HP it's not a game changer. I love Yamaha but this is yet another chapter in a long list of disappointments for me with Yamaha.
Here is my idea of a game changer
1. Dry weight 500 pounds
2. Weight weight 575
3. 165 HP
4. Power Steering With a C&A razor type ski with 10 inches of carbide.
5. New Chassis
6. New Rear suspension that works like a mono in studder pumps and
and Nytro RTX SE in the moguls
7. New front end that has Zero Ski lift and corners like it's on rails but still eats the bumps Nytro RTX SE in the moguls
8. High out magneto that allows hand warms to work at all times and keep yoru hands warm at any temp.
9. True closed loop fuel Injection.
If I was to build a sled by taking pieces from the four OEMs the only piece I'd use from Yamaha is Power Steering. In my book that's pretty sad considering the "game changer" Promotion!!!!!!!
SledFreak
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I agree, well said... But I will be optimistic and wait for marketing brochure to read up on it, since Chris Reid won't bring it to Northern Ontario for us to test ride.
TurboJamie
TY 4 Stroke God
SledFreak said:
x2
RW06GT
Extreme
Yer all pretty down on something that none of you have experienced more than a blown up picture of. Seems short sighted to me. If it handles as good or better than my wifes xr1200 I will be impressed as well as opening my checkbook for two. 
dirkdiggler
Suspended
RW06GT said:Yer all pretty down on something that none of you have experienced more than a blown up picture of. Seems short sighted to me. If it handles as good or better than my wifes xr1200 I will be impressed as well as opening my checkbook for two.
It's easy to be down on a sled that looks just like an Apex that is called a game changer!!!! We know from the ride review that it's down on power. We Know from the pictures that the Chassis, Front and rear suspension remain the same as the apex.
Don't call a sled a game changer and get people pumped to have them find out it's an Apex with Power Steering, 128 inch, and some different skis.
You know Even a Nytro with power steering and 150 hp would be more of a game changer!!!
I really like the idea of creating a parameter list but we need to do a better job of describing the actual value of some of the items.dirkdiggler said:
Items 1-3 are simply numbers, what will achieving those targets actually do for me the customer?
Item 4 infers value but what does it mean? I'm thinking it means the sled holds a line with minimal steering effort but I'm really just guessing.
Item 5 simply infers change for the sake of change, what does it do for me?
Items 6, 7 and 8 are valuable. Those are things we as consumers want our suppliers to deliver.
Item 9 Again, What does that do for me?
Just some more grist for the mill.
dirkdiggler
Suspended
Another example is the Switch from the RX-1 to the apex. The Apex was nothing more then a RX-1 with Fuel injection and a reconfigured steering gate. The Apex Should have been what was released in 2003.The RX-1 was and unrefined or crude example of an Apex.
dirkdiggler
Suspended
RW06GT
Extreme
I'm still not sure why any one would expect a completely different look. From what I've been reading, far more people would be disappointed if the sled were to be more nytro like. I for one love the look of the Apex and would be unhappy if they took the sled in the direction of the nytro. For me, refinement goes a long way.
Now the game changer moniker is certainly subjective and if marketing is relating that directly to the power steering, I think it fits. I see many benefits with almost zero drawbacks.
Completely disagree with the assertion that the rx-1 should have been anything more than it was. You have to start somewhere. And it was more about the motor than anything else.
Also we have no idea in what ways the chassis may have been changed as I have not seen anyone report on what is under the new plastic. You can see a mono, which IMO is a great design especially since they seem to have addressed the durability issues. Who knows what detail changes are involved there, the suspensions in the pics are full of snow? The front end looks similar as well, but geometry changes can make profound handling changes(ask nytro owners). All we basically have are ride impressions and they sound good to me.
As for your list, who's to say it is not at least 165 hp, or that they haven't cut some weight(doubt 50 lbs though)? And a couple of the ride impressions do in fact indicate acceptable hand warmers.
Bottom line for me, is I LIKE what I see and will wait for more details before pronouncing it some kind of failure.
Now the game changer moniker is certainly subjective and if marketing is relating that directly to the power steering, I think it fits. I see many benefits with almost zero drawbacks.
Completely disagree with the assertion that the rx-1 should have been anything more than it was. You have to start somewhere. And it was more about the motor than anything else.
Also we have no idea in what ways the chassis may have been changed as I have not seen anyone report on what is under the new plastic. You can see a mono, which IMO is a great design especially since they seem to have addressed the durability issues. Who knows what detail changes are involved there, the suspensions in the pics are full of snow? The front end looks similar as well, but geometry changes can make profound handling changes(ask nytro owners). All we basically have are ride impressions and they sound good to me.
As for your list, who's to say it is not at least 165 hp, or that they haven't cut some weight(doubt 50 lbs though)? And a couple of the ride impressions do in fact indicate acceptable hand warmers.
Bottom line for me, is I LIKE what I see and will wait for more details before pronouncing it some kind of failure.
SledFreak
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The tunnel is different... It looks to be tipped up in the back if you look at it close... I think the two big things that look disappointing is that the hp just does not look to be overly impressive(meaning people arn't screaming about it). The second is the front of it, still looks like an Apex. They could of atleast changed the head lights. Not to say it needed to look like a Nytro, but a little change would have been nice..
The headlight change I would like to see is to have a hi & low beam that was useful. Maybe this new machine fixes that and you won't have to choose between looking at ski tips or tree tops.
dirkdiggler
Suspended
RW06GT said:
If you don't think Yamaha had An apex sitting Next the the rx-1 the day it was released in 2003 your kidding yourself. Yamaha has an advanced planing and development department. The replacement for this sled is already sitting somewhere at Yamaha.
I can tell you I know of a lot of people on this forum who love Yamaha and they are not happy. some of these guys are long time Yamaha owners that jumped ship and thought they would be able to come back. That's not going to happen now.
I like my Nytro, Don't love it. I can tell you This sled will not replace the Nytro and if Yamaha doesn't build something close to what I described in the next few years I'm jumping ship. I've owned 12 Yamaha's since 1998. I'm loyal to Yamaha. This is the first time in 12 years I've thought about jumping ship!!!!
RW06GT
Extreme
I don't doubt that Yamaha has the new sleds replacement at the very least in testing by now.
I still think you are reading way to much into a short ride review and some unclear pictures but to each his own. And for the record, I don't know that the pictures are an accurate representation of what the sled will look like. It's pretty easy to disguise plastic, and I have never seen Yamaha let one out of the bag before they want to. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but there may be some misdirection going on here. I like what I see, just give me some blue.
I doubt you are the only long term Yamaha owner here. My first Yamaha sled was a used 79 or 80 exciter 440 when I was about 12. Been on Yammies and cats ever since. This year we picked up a 1200 doo(first doo) for my wife after she wrecked her cat, so I am well aware of what is offered by the competition. And nothing is built as well imo. I'll probably always own at least one Yamaha and can tell you that my Attak will be kept for no other reason than I love it. It's taken a while and some money, but for me, it is damn near perfect.
I still think you are reading way to much into a short ride review and some unclear pictures but to each his own.
And for the record, I don't know that the pictures are an accurate representation of what the sled will look like. It's pretty easy to disguise plastic, and I have never seen Yamaha let one out of the bag before they want to. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but there may be some misdirection going on here. I like what I see, just give me some blue.I doubt you are the only long term Yamaha owner here. My first Yamaha sled was a used 79 or 80 exciter 440 when I was about 12. Been on Yammies and cats ever since. This year we picked up a 1200 doo(first doo) for my wife after she wrecked her cat, so I am well aware of what is offered by the competition. And nothing is built as well imo. I'll probably always own at least one Yamaha and can tell you that my Attak will be kept for no other reason than I love it. It's taken a while and some money, but for me, it is damn near perfect.
Thanks for the clarification of your points Jason.
dirkdiggler
Suspended
RW06GT said:I don't doubt that Yamaha has the new sleds replacement at the very least in testing by now.
I still think you are reading way to much into a short ride review and some unclear pictures but to each his own.
I doubt you are the only long term Yamaha owner here. My first Yamaha sled was a used 79 or 80 exciter 440 when I was about 12. Been on Yammies and cats ever since. This year we picked up a 1200 doo(first doo) for my wife after she wrecked her cat, so I am well aware of what is offered by the competition. And nothing is built as well imo. I'll probably always own at least one Yamaha and can tell you that my Attak will be kept for no other reason than I love it. It's taken a while and some money, but for me, it is damn near perfect.
I'm not saying I don't love Yamaha, I do.
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